Chitty Chats with Stacy

Jen Stein
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[00:00:00]

Hey friends,

welcome back. My name is Stacy. For those of you who are just tuning in, I'm Stacy York. I'm a licensed clinical social worker. I am doing this beautiful YouTube series where I've invited some of my favorite humans on the planet. And I happen to be very lucky. I know a lot of really amazing humans.

And today I have one of my dear friends. I'm going to call you dear friend. I feel like we've moved into that zone. Started as dear colleague, became dear friend, Jen Stein. Jen is going to do a little introducing of herself, but let me tell you a few things I love about Jen. Jen is one of these humans that has been on this journey with me for quite a long time, and I've had the privilege of just having a front row seat to observe some of the awesomeness she's doing.

So, she's a beautiful principal in Kalispell, Montana. [00:01:00] And she has just taken this job as a principal in a heart centered way, and I love watching it, Jen. So, okay, tell us a little bit about you, and then we'll talk more about your heart centered

approach to life. Yeah, so, uh Minnesota born and then Montana for college and then fell in love with the state.

So studied in Washington for a while and taught there and worked there for a while and then we got to move back to our dream town of Kalispell, Montana. Um, my husband and I have two beautiful children. Um, who are mostly always wonderful, but not always. Um, one is 15, and a high school girl, Kaylin, and Luke, is 13, and, um, going into 8th grade, and on the autism spectrum, and so our journey as parents, and me as an educator, has really been diverse, and not what I expected, but totally what I needed.

So, I got a job [00:02:00] here, this will be my 10th year. Um, as an administrator here at Edgerton Elementary School, and we have 520 kids, and an amazing staff, and a really great community, and one of six elementary schools in our district, so that's about the size of the school district and school I come from, and I, um, You know, who I thought I'd become and what my life would be and what it has actually become is so much better, but definitely not traditional.

Um, when you're raising a neurodiverse kiddo and I think just parenting in general gives you this, you initially think like you're going to nail it and it's going to be this way and then you have the kids and you're like, It's a different way than I thought. So that has been my experience as both an educator and a parent, and they've actually weaved together quite a bit.

So quite a bit of who I am is, um, an educator, a mom, and then a wife, and [00:03:00] a friend, um, a daughter. Those things are all really important to me as far as, like, who I am.

one of the reasons I chose you to chat with Jen is because much like me, you do not cross the threshold of your school building and leave all these parts about you out.

Like you are just who you are. You are Jen, mom of teenager, mom of neurodivergent kid, wife of someone in the community. Like you are just Jen. And I love that about you. And part of the journey and the work that I do when I cross the United States and I talk to humans is people have this It's sort of, I think this maybe idea that to be a professional, you gotta have all your shit together.

Yeah.

And

I just, I'm curious about your thoughts

on that. Well, that'd be a bummer. Um, I just don't have any of it together. And I think when you talk about the threshold, like it just, I do, it's just, I am who I am throughout every [00:04:00] part of my life. Um, and I don't know when that started and I don't know. I think.

I think it's when my kids were younger and you, you like try to keep it together and be who you think you're supposed to be. And then I don't know if you get tired or you meet the right people who meet you where you are and share an experience, but not being perfect really has, is quite liberating. And, and everybody knows my imperfections because I share them just fine.

Though it's much easier to do that at work than it is. In your personal life, like I'm wrong all the time at work, and then at home, so rare, I don't know why, so I think that that does become, it's just who I am, so that I don't have to change venues, um, at all, like it just is who I am, I don't think I obsess about it at all.

work things at home in a way that I can't get through it or that I Take everything from home and bring it to school, but who I am at my core and my [00:05:00] value system And how I make decisions those are very much intertwined and I actually um When people say just work is work and leave work at work I get offended because it's not something i'm capable of doing nor do I think I would be Uh, enjoying my job as much as I do, if I did that.

So, for anybody who thinks that we're supposed to be working, home is supposed to be home, and they have to be separate, if that works for you, that's great. But in my experience, and in my work, it does not. And I'm actually better when I balance both. Yeah, and I

think that part of what I've seen in some of your journey is that your home life really influences your work life, right?

You have a very, I'm guessing, a very different experience because you're a parent of a neurodivergent kid. When you're sitting in IEP meetings as a principal, you probably have a very different perspective because your home life has influenced your work, much like The information and the learning you do at your [00:06:00] job probably influences your parenting and home life.

So, yeah, I think that, um, I've noticed that the connection with parents and, um, empathy, it's hard to say. I've always been a pretty empathetic person, but I think that there's just more room for error and there's more room for not knowing. And like, I just accept when parents are like, I'm just not doing it the way I wish I was, or, you know, they make a mistake that.

part of my life has increased so much because of, you know, you read what you should do and all of the love and logic. This is how you should talk to your kids. And it's like, well, that's not what happened in my house this morning. And, and I think that that imperfection has really helped me be a more open minded.

Um, Empathetic Principal, not just person, as far as like, system changes, and what do we need for kids, um, and how to advocate for kids. I think that that's really helped me, because I can think outside of the [00:07:00] box. And I don't know where the lines cross, but I I think of every student at this school as somebody's baby and treating them that way.

And so it's just like, just okay is not enough for an unhappy kid or a kid who doesn't feel like they have a place of belonging in their school. Like that's just unacceptable. Um, and so I think that that's. And then the diversity of being in a school and all the different, you know, like what, what my children and I experienced, what I experienced in childhood, that is a very different experience than what some of our students that are in homelessness or in foster care and have experienced.

And so their experiences shaped me, um, because of what I learned from them and their resiliency is much higher than mine. Mine has ever been. And so I think there's just some things like that that you learn from your students and then you hope to bring the good stuff to your own parenting and kids.[00:08:00]

So one of the things that you and I've been doing is this trauma informed support group for administrators over the last three years, really. And I just want to talk a little bit about how much education has just. shifted in the last three years since COVID and what you're doing to keep your head above water and support your staff keeping their head above water.

What are your thoughts about that?

Yeah, you know, um, when you become a principal and everything in education really is centered around kids. Like if you don't love kids and want to fight for kids and work for kids, it's not for you. But as an administrator, almost equal to, um, is caring about the adults that you work with.

And so I think the biggest shift that I've had is how do I take care of adults? And when COVID happened, I immediately felt responsible. There's about with staff, there's usually about 600, a little over 600 people in this building. And all of a sudden I felt responsible for the health, both [00:09:00] emotional and physical health of 600 people.

And then I realized that that feeling.

And so I just thought, what, what am I going to do so that one, I don't like freeze and paralysis because I'm overwhelmed, but what can I do? Cause the reality is you are not going to be able to keep physical or emotional harm from happening to the people you work with because there's a lot of outside influences, but it's like, what is my role and how can I be responsible?

And really it was about creating a space. Um. Where people felt good and safe and listened to, and so all the things you do for students as far as the love and belonging work that you do, you do for adults and you, um, tap into things that I think you'd initially think, oh, it's just for kids, like check in forms or gratitude work.

Um, you think, well, it's for kids, but it really isn't. And I think the shift in our gratitude [00:10:00] work and honest conversations and just honesty about mistakes and owning those and really trying to model that has shifted a lot. Um, people have talked a lot about mental health here, which has been great and not in a way that's inappropriate.

Big speeches or call people out. They just kind of in casual conversation talk about maybe a Strategy they're using with their therapist and they talk to their colleagues about it. And so it's just become more of a norm and so we've done things like we have a wellness room where there's a massage chair and a quiet dark space for and some like of the seasonal light to come at you instead of fluorescent just to recognize that This is needed.

Um, and you give opportunities for whatever they some people don't want that. Um, they want to go for a walk during their prep time or you know, whatever you kind of need to do to help them feel regulated as adults. And then when you do [00:11:00] that, not only do they get ideas for their students, but they're just more able to do it.

Um, and that's just been a really big shift for us and it's just created a really happy place. Um, and it's not like we're this utopian perfect, like we never have conflict, but I think what's shifted is we can talk about what's hard or a conflict we have, um, without the gossip or the side conversations.

We just bring it to the table. Hey, I'm not doing well. Can you help me? Um, can you cover my class? I need a break. Um, having teachers ask for help. That's a, That's hard. Like they just really, you know, and so it's like, what environment are we creating that we think that they think they can ask for help. Um, and so we just kind of really worked, done that work, but it's really nothing so groundbreaking.

It's just what's best for students. And then you do the same thing for adults. I love that

you're just like, eh, it's not that groundbreaking, and yet we are [00:12:00] seeing educators leave in droves. Yeah. Because it actually is groundbreaking, Jen.

It is, and it seems, you know, it's interesting, and it's not until you stop and you think, you know, I haven't hired a, a gen ed teacher in two years, or, you know, we had to have staff move because we didn't have enough space, um.

That you realize and it's, you know, as a principal, you have to set a tone, but it's always the community as a whole. So it's like the community we build. And so, you know, teachers. You see them take care of each other, and I think, um, an example that we talked about that feels not groundbreaking, but then when you pause, you're like, this isn't an everyday thing in everybody's world.

But I remember a teacher looking upset and being in the staff lounge and another teacher saying, Are you okay? And she said, I'm not actually like, I'm really upset. You know, my parents were supposed to arrive and the train got canceled and, and it's really going to [00:13:00] be hard on my kids and, and shared what was happening, which I think one is actually groundbreaking that people can share when they're not okay.

I think it's so healthy. And then the. response was, that's so hard. Is there something we can do for you? Or what do you need? That was the question. What do you need? And I thought, that is lovely. And we talk about that all the time for kids. They check in in zones, and if they're not in the green, the next question a kid will ask is, what do you need?

And so we teach kids to do that, but it's like, do we give that space for adults? And knowing that it is in some ways different than what the norm is, is because I recognize that that happened. And if it happened all the time, in every environment, you wouldn't even notice. But it's not often that people feel safe to say that they aren't well, and that instead of fixing it, the question was, what do you need?

Um, I just thought it was really powerful and probably a [00:14:00] foundation of why the teachers in this building are so incredible. They just take care of each other.

I love this. And I would imagine that when the viewers view this, they're going to be like, Jen's just like, this is normal. This is how we do our other teachers are going to be like, sign

me up.

How do I

work for this person? And they're just, you have just created this space for people to be safe. And for people when they don't feel regulated to be able to say, I don't feel regulated. I'm not. I, and I just, I love that about you. And you're sort of like, it's just what we do. And others are like, no, actually Jen, not everyone does that.

Like it's a gift of yours. And the fact that you just normalize this human behavior, you normalize the human experience you love. People, you support love and belonging. That is such a gift that you have that is really important and I'm glad you're

sharing that. Well, and I think like, and you know that you, Bruce Perry, um, [00:15:00] Brene Brown, like some of these people are super influential on how I think.

And so, and it doesn't mean that that's for everybody but There is somebody probably out there that does connect with you. And I think that we sometimes read things and are inspired, but they don't feel actionable. And so once I found like Brene and Bruce Perry and then you and making it feel like, Oh, this is, this does tap into my values.

Cause you don't even sometimes know what your values are. You're just doing your job. And a lot of the work with Brene and stuff is like, what are your values? What are your values as a person? And what are your organizational values? And then once. I thought about that, then everything has to fall in line in those values.

And so it's really shifted how I think. And there's so many different people out there that can do that. But to me, it's not like I, you come up with your own ideas eventually, but initially you just start thinking about you. What do I believe to be true? [00:16:00] And then that's the filter for all the decisions you make.

But I was definitely inspired by reading and having somebody push me. It was a big growth for me before I could turn it into something for the school.

So as we think about teachers, families, administrators coming back to school in the fall, what are some of the highlights or the top three things that you find are just valuable, maybe in your toolbox at home, your toolbox at school that really kind of get you through that initial hump of like coming back to school, starting the school year.

Oh, we're back to work. Those kinds of things. Also that transition time with kids. Cause you and I both know August and September are like wild, right? It's a deeply transitioned time of dysregulation. So what are some thoughts or values that you hold or things that could be helpful for people?

I do think a lot of it goes around [00:17:00] gratitude, and so, like, I spend the weeks preparing for school, um, writing notes to every member of our staff, and so, that just puts my mind right, and I'm just actually grateful for that.

So excited when I'm doing that because I'm so excited to see them and then when you have kids It's sort of in the same way like focusing around gratitude. Like what have we enjoyed together? What but what are we excited for? What are we anxious about? and just kind of Naming those things and I think when people do and like I don't want to give the impression that my family like sits down to dinner every night and we go in a circle we say the thing like we I don't even know if we're in the same house sometimes during dinner.

So, it's not like it's this really fancy, uh, hard to do thing. It's just when you're talking to your kids, um, we just like to talk about it. And I talk about what I'm excited for, what I'm nervous about, um. And there was just something really [00:18:00] liberating that shifted and I can't tell if it's because of like the friendships I developed Um, or what happened that I feel so Fine about saying exactly how I feel and not feeling any shame around those feelings And I think that the more we talk about that for students and for our own kids um, and then for my spouse because I am not My kindest, most, and I'm not even really that patient in general, but definitely less patient in September.

I am so tired and I'm excited and the energy it takes just to be in a building. It's so high. And then, you know, last year I had a kid just starting high school for the first time. So that anxiety and those feelings come out all sideways. And so, learning to be like, wow, I'm really anxious about this, or I'm really nervous.

And kids are shocked that teachers and principals are nervous for the first day of school, but we also are. Um, and so I think [00:19:00] that really, if you're like, just be authentic, and if you can tap into why you're feeling what you're feeling, that's great. Because it really is the It's pretty hard to nail down, and our behaviors are real sporadic and random, and you have to kind of pull the thread to see why you're actually responding that way, but I think when we model it to our kids, our spouse, like my husband's way more understanding probably when I'm snappy and maybe to say three words before I head straight to bed, when I can say, this is how I feel in September.

It's really hard. Um, and so that's what I would say. Um, yeah. Has really changed things for me is just really tapping into authentic emotion and just naming it and not being embarrassed by it. Love that.

Gratitude is so big. Uh, for the last two years, my best friend and I send each other three gratefuls every night.

We text each other, grateful for this. And we've, we've paused for a year and then we're like, no, we got to keep doing this. And if we [00:20:00] miss a couple of days, then we'll send Friday grateful, Saturday grateful, Sunday grateful. And it really helps to have someone to do that with. It's really taken a shift, I think, for both of us.

We feel better, right? Like, and you're connecting! That connection is there. And then, you know, that whole piece of name it to tame it is what we say. Name your

feelings. That's good. Right?

Um, that's, I believe that's Dan Siegel. Name it to

tame it. Well, I think it's because I'm such a control freak that it's like the idea of this emotion taking off without me.

It doesn't feel good, so I'm like, let's name this thing so that I can have some sort of, yeah, plan over it. And I think what you said about your friend is so important because it's, I don't do New Year's resolutions because I just don't follow through. Like, it's like, why disappoint myself with my inability?

And so finding the thing that works for you. So if it's not writing a journal every day, because that is not for me, but it's texting a [00:21:00] friend or Sometimes I just go on Facebook and I say, I'm going to write five positive comments on somebody's like, just something to get you through. Yeah. That you can do.

That's not like, you don't have to feel bad that you fail at it. It doesn't have to be a big journal. Like I love that you text that. I think that's a good idea. It's really nice.

And I think over time, her and I have both valued, like, you know, you're going to connect with someone every day and, you know, you're going to have that every day in a way, someone who loves you, right?

Not just someone that you have to show up for, not your kid, uh, who, you know, sporadically loves you and sporadically

Right, sometimes not. And I think, but I also think when you share it, you inspire others to think things differently. So we start every staff meeting with Five gift cards that I purchased and I lay out on the table and then people come in and they take them and then give them to somebody else in front of the group and say I'm giving this coffee card to so and so because [00:22:00] she's been showing up for our students like when she didn't need to and and then it just sort of one it starts your meeting in gratitude and then it also is something like you're always looking for it and Which is fantastic.

And then sometimes you don't even think to be grateful for something because it's been such a part of your life. And somebody reminds you that like, things are pretty great. I should be thankful for that. So. I love that. I, Jen,

I am so grateful for you and the journey that we've had together, and I love the how you just show up and you are often this light that shares the hard, right?

You've been through a lot of hard, your community's been through a lot of hard, your state's been through a lot of hard, and education, and you're also like, you know what? It's hard, and these humans in my building need me, and this is how I show up for people, and yeah. We appreciate that

so much about you.

I think that for educators too, like there's When you look at the big picture, it seems like sometimes an insurmountable [00:23:00] task to take on every concern that anybody has about public ed. And then I walk back in this building and I'm like, no, this is the world that I need to take care of and be a part of.

And it's so incredible. And we're just like, being a public educator is such a gift. Like, I'm just lucky to be a part of it and leave a mark and get to be honored to help be a part of. Like we, we do not take for granted that people drop their babies off to us every day for seven hours and that we have the opportunity to be with them.

So it's really a joyful profession. And if people are still worried about it. These young kids were saying like, but are they giving you a hard time? No, there's way more good than there are the challenges. So public ed is definitely the place to be. I

just, that, the way you just said that is exactly why I called you and I said, Jen, we have to have a conversation that people can listen because we hear all the negative and you have so much goodness.

And one of the things I think, you [00:24:00] know, is important is that when it does feel insurmountable in this big, huge national way or federally or statewide. Remember what you have that's tangible. That's right in front of you and just showing up and being that positive person in public ed is exactly what public

ed needs.

So, and you don't do it alone, right? You don't do it alone. You have a community of people. Cause it's okay to feel like sometimes I just go home and take a nap under a weighted blanket because that's not the time to take on my thing. But then when I wake up. I can take the weighted blanket off and then go forth again, but you, you cannot do it alone.

And I think you have different people in your life for different purposes. And I definitely am surrounded by people in this school district who, um, we've, we've helped each other. Like, it's okay to say like, today is so hard and I don't want to do this today. And those things you can't just pretend like it's not a big deal because sometimes it is a big deal.

Um, but you always have somebody. with you. So go, go in groups, go [00:25:00] in tribes when you take on the hard things. Love that.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for your time today. I appreciate you. I'm so excited about the gifts you're offering our community. So till we meet again, my friends. Thank you.

See you soon.

Bye.