Chitty Chats with Stacy

Stacy Nation: I am thrilled to
have Morgan Oaks with me today.

Morgan, you and I have this
weird long history together and.

We've known each other from our hometown.

We reunited a few years ago.

You did some coaching with me and you
were just this beautiful spirit and I'm

gonna let you introduce yourself 'cause
you're kick ass human and you, there's

a million things I will never cover.

Uh, and then we're gonna
get into some stuff today.

So thank you for joining
me and being here today.

I really appreciate it.

Morgan Oaks: Yeah.

Well I was excited to hear that you were
launching this, so honored to be on it.

And yeah, I think like just to touch
base on that, like to not run by it.

Grew up in a really small town in Wyoming.

And so then like years later, you
and I get in contact and we've got

these like kind of parallel lives as
far as like personal growth, trying

to help each other, help others,
as well as helping ourselves, uh,

through our own growth processes.

And I think that's been
pretty rare for us.

Yeah.

Uh, experiencing that as far
as, uh, from where we came from.

And so just, yeah.

So grateful to be on this and, uh.

Yeah, for the introduction,
my name's Morgan Oaks.

I'm a, a number of things as well.

I'm a, uh, 20 year chiropractor,
uh, and I do that part-time.

Now.

I'm also a certified high performance
coach, a shamanic practitioner in

my path to like learning who I was.

Uh, I just kept adding other things into
the mix that I could help people with.

Or got really good at referring
out in those things that I just

weren't my, in my wheelhouse.

Um, and probably the last thing I'm really
integrating now is I've, I've had kind

of a lot of, uh, intuitive pressure.

To start working directly with men.

Mm-Hmm.

And so I'm taking men on trips to Mexico
to do like deep, uh, initiation type

personal growth, uh, as well as launching
an online men's men's coaching program.

And I think that encapsulates at least
enough for us to, yeah, to dive in.

Stacy Nation: Yeah, so there's so
many parts of my journey with you

that I, I think are important.

So part of the reason I'm doing this
series is I have a whole group of humans

in my life that I serve in a mental health
capacity in my teaching practice, in

my, my speaking practice, and I have all
these amazing resources at my fingertips.

Uh, of humans who have
been on this journey.

And one of the things that I love about
you and I and our connection later in

life is that there is this deep ingrained
messaging of growing up in Wyoming that

I think both of us have had to unpack.

And really evaluate.

And as you know, I'm in the Wyoming Guard.

I serve a lot of men.

I work with a lot of men and, and
I have a love of men that is very

deep as a woman who's also a strong
woman who's done feminist side, like

the femininity and the masculinity
of those sides is so important.

And the reason I reached out
to you, Morgan, is because.

I think you've unpacked some of
that messaging that men get Mm-Hmm.

Those pieces that are so deeply ingrained
in how we grow up in certain cultures.

And I'm just wondering if you can speak
a little bit to that in your own journey,

in your own sort of, you know, growth.

Morgan Oaks: Yeah.

One of the first things that came to
mind when you were, when, when you were

sharing is just really around possibility.

Hmm.

Right?

Like when we were growing up, you know,
for me to go away from to college, I

became a mechanical engineer first.

Um, and the reality is like
that went well beyond even what

was kind of expected of me.

Right.

There's a lot of things I could have done
that I probably would've been kind of

like base level, happy, probably income,
happy, you know, life experience, happy.

But I knew that it didn't encapsulate
everything that I was wanting.

And for me, I really wanted
to go for something difficult.

I really wanted to push myself,
and that ended up happening.

You know, certainly with education
and career, but also with like what

I could do physically, uh, it's
kind of dove into what I can do

mentally, spiritually, emotionally.

And so the big first thing for me was just
allowing a possibility that was bigger

than what I was, um, kind of typecast for.

I love that.

Right?

Yeah.

And that was, that's what
started opening things up.

And then I would bump into
these like glass ceilings

and I'm like, oh, this is me.

It's not where I'm living.

It's not career.

It's not that woman I'm
in relationship with.

Like this is mine.

And I think there's a balance
betwe, especially for men.

Like we do have to be kind of egoically
strong in that we have to know who we are.

We have to know what we believe in.

And I think a lot of people have
pushed away from like, oh, ego, like

we're supposed to dissolve that.

But no, like ego's the thing that gets you
to stand up when somebody else in your,

um, military group is out of integrity.

Right?

Right.

It's what gets you to step up in
your friend group or family group

when somebody's out of integrity or
things are going in a bad direction.

It's how you can really define
and know who that you are.

You know who you are so that you can make.

Those decisions that seem right to you.

And it, it takes a strength and
a healthy ego to be able to, to

know thyself and to take action in
those moments that are important.

So that's one half of the equation.

But I think we can get typecast
and like never breaking down, never

admitting fault, never admitting that
there's a question mark on our heart.

Not complete, you know, knowingness.

And so the other half that I've really
leaned into is like when I realized that.

I'm plateaued that I
don't have the answers.

That maybe what was an integrity in
my twenties might not be an integrity

in my thirties or forties, you know?

And then starting to go after those,
those limitations and just being

courageous and curious and, and, um,
and then seeing how that unfolds.

Knowing that, uh, this song that I
always quote from Wyoming, when you're

going through, hell keep on going.

I.

I think it's so true 'cause a lot
of people end up living in hell

relationship, career, health levels,
you know, level of mental, emotional

happiness, and they just stay there.

They freeze.

And so for me it's about find
those places and then do what

you can to move beyond them.

Stacy Nation: Love that.

Love, love, love.

So many pieces about that.

One of the pieces that I find so
fascinating in my work with men is

this messaging around vulnerability
not being a strength, vulnerability

being a weakness, and this mantra
of vulnerability and strength can

actually exist at the same time.

Both can be true, and I'm just
curious if you have thoughts on that.

I would imagine you probably have a few.

Morgan Oaks: Yeah, well, background in
engineering and knowing about metals, but

also that crossover with the military.

And if we think about a sword, right?

If you create a sword in such a way
that it's the, the hardest thing

out there, it has no flexibility.

And ultimately what happens is it breaks.

So in that you need a, a, a balance
between really good strength, but also

kind of a, a softness and flexibility.

And I think that's true for us as well.

And that's, that is one of the hardest
places when you create this persona or

ego of like having the answers, being
strong, um, having grit, resilience,

all these words that we really.

Are attracted to through the
personal growth realm and, and,

and being a strong woman or man.

But within that, we've seen
what it looks like when people

don't admit that they need help.

There's an issue they've plateaued.

Um, you know, and, and when they
don't reach out, then we, we've

seen those people break or things go
extremely sideways or them even crash

relationships, careers, you know, lives.

For sure.

Stacy Nation: One of the
things that I've always.

Loved about you, Morgan, even when I
knew you in our high school days, and

then when I reconnected with you when I
was on my journey of looking for a high

performance coach, and I find out that
you and I are in the same worlds together.

Mm-Hmm.

And I'm like Morgan, like the
Morgan I know is doing this work.

Like how does that, what,
what, what does that happen?

You are one of the most
curious humans on the planet.

Like you Curiosity.

To me, when I think about
curiosity, I think a lot about you.

And the, the reason I
think about you is 'cause.

Again, we grew up in a small
place where a lot of people stay.

Not very many people leave.

If you leave, you're being very brave
if you leave and you have gone on

these major journeys in your life
all over the world, really to explore

these different facets of yourself.

And I'm just curious about maybe one
or two lessons that you've received

in your life when you've gotten
curious, like what was the value

of having curiosity in your life?

Morgan Oaks: Yeah.

I intuition's a major through
line for all the work that I do.

Mm-Hmm.

Um, it's what my TEDx talk is about.

It's, uh, it was a big part of
my, like spiritual awakening.

Mm-Hmm.

But if we get away from words
that get confusing, the reality

is we all have those, that
internal guidance system, right.

Great athletes have it.

Moms, you know, certainly have it.

Hunters have it.

Like anybody who is able to gather
wisdom that doesn't come from their mind.

Right and blend that.

We all have access to that.

So the biggest piece I think that's
important for curiosity is we know

those things we're interested in.

Hmm.

Right?

It's that thing like, oh, I should read
that book, I should read that book.

And then somebody comes to you,
Hey, I have a book for you to read.

You should already know the
name of it 'cause you've

already been thinking about it.

Right.

Um, or like, yeah, I, you know, yes,
this is a great career, but I feel I.

Really flatline.

But what I really would be interested
in is this other thing, you know?

And even if it's getting on a website,
looking at it, what it would be like

to, you know, take some online classes
or go to school in the evenings.

Like if you have a curiosity about
something, it's usually really low,

um, energy and expense entry point
to just start checking it out and

see if that's, you know, maybe it's
a hobby, maybe it's a side passion,

or maybe it's that thing that.

Has been trying to like get you to,
to lean into it your whole life.

So I'm big on really following
those nudges and just, just

seeing what's out there.

Stacy Nation: Love that.

In your work with men, do you find
that when you give them permission

to follow those nudges, their whole
world is starting to like open up and

break free and it gets pretty exciting?

Morgan Oaks: Yeah.

And for some people it's
the question, right?

Some people we lean more into courage.

Yeah.

You know, 'cause I think
we all know those places.

Where we're I?

Playing small, holding back,
not asking the question, not

opening the conversation, not,
you know, making the phone call.

Mm-Hmm.

And so sometimes it's a simple clarity
and, and most people know what that

thing is that's waiting for them.

You know, sometimes it's really realizing,
oh, I think I'm strong, I think I do

all the things I want, because maybe
they have, you know, the relationship

and they've got the high paying job
and they're like, I'm courageous.

I do all these things.

But it's like looking at, okay,
where do you have resistance?

Where are you ignoring?

What's there, where do you
go into procrastination?

Right?

Looking for some of those more
subtle things to show us where

there's a lack of courage.

And sometimes if they don't know where
that clarity piece is, we all will

probably know where we're not being
as directly courageous as we could be.

Yeah.

Right.

So between those two
things, I do find that.

As a coach, if you can ask good
questions as a speaker, as a

speaker, as a coach, as a therapist,
if you can ask good questions.

Once people answer that question,
they'll never forget it.

It's almost, it's almost like, yeah, it's,
it's like a curse on a certain level.

Like if a person asks you a
good question and you answer it

wholeheartedly, you'll never forget
it, and it will stick with you.

And it helps create action.

Stacy Nation: I love that.

I love that so much.

And that good questions
are so healing, right?

Like they're such gifts and You're
a good question asker Morgan.

So thank you.

Yeah, you do well with that.

Uh, one of my, one of my curiosities is
there's so many messages that men get.

In our life that are not always helpful.

So I'm curious about how you help people
unpack some of the messaging that they've

gotten, some of the, like how they
align with, wait a minute, I've gotten

this message but I'm not feeling it.

How do I break free from that?

What are some, what are some of the
strategies, helpful hints you have

along the way to any of the men
that might be listening to this?

Morgan Oaks: Yeah.

One of the greatest things I think is
maybe even just sitting down and like.

Journaling or if you don't have
a journal, some people don't like

to have a journal, use a notebook.

You can write it all down, pull
it out, shred it or throw it away.

But just kind of writing your story.

Yeah.

You know, and you can lean into like,
yeah, what things are a massive blessing

in your past and what things were
something that maybe you wish that

you didn't experience from the past.

Mm-Hmm.

You know?

And what part of those things
from the past still kind of

show up in the present day?

You know, and that'll give an idea of, a
lot of times I feel like that sets kind

of the railroad tracks for where we move.

Mm-Hmm.

And then we have to be really
conscious about the past to

dismantle that like guidance system.

Sure.

So that we can actually have, uh,
freedom of choice moving forward.

You know, so sometimes it's
diving into that, it's just

going through a good history and
conversation, um, you know, and.

I think most of us, I like the statement
that 80% of everything's always working.

Hmm.

Right.

80% of everything's always working,
and usually when people come to us,

they're focusing on the 20% that isn't.

Yeah.

Right.

So if we can get them into gratitude
about the 80% that's out there, we

know there's improved health and
happiness scores, you know, there's

all these great things that happen.

But then again, if we look at that 20% I.

That's not working.

Might feel like a plateau.

It might feel like a
place that you're bored.

It might be a place that
you show up as boring.

Yeah.

Um, it might be a struggle.

It might be that thing that, um,
when it comes up, you'd rather

choose Netflix, a substance, you
know, scrolling through your phone.

Like those are really great places to go.

Okay.

Like, I don't even know what's
here, but when this comes up.

I get fidgety or I zone out, or I, I
reach for a ice cream sandwich, you

know, whatever, whatever that might be.

Those type of things can at least
point us in the right direction.

Love

Stacy Nation: that.

Love that.

So one of the pickles I have, so
I do a ton of work with educators.

I do a lot of work with women educators,
and I've been going down this road

of boys in classrooms and how we
tamper their energy a little bit or

they're too active or they're too
busy or they're too this or too that.

And I often say to the many
educators, I'll say, what are

the messages we're sending boys?

That are now playing out in
our marriages where we're

saying, you're not open enough.

You're not giving me enough to
talk about when they got these

messages, when they were really
little, like, I'm too much now, so

maybe I gotta rein it all in later.

So I think a huge piece for me and
my journey is how do we help women

also love men for who men are?

And I'm wondering if you have
any insight or any thoughts about

just some things to help women in
the journey of men becoming men.

And Right.

Morgan Oaks: Wild question, right?

Yeah.

I think this will apply to everybody.

So, uh, when I lived in Seattle,
I lived up there for a decade

and they had these amazing places
you could go do like a foot soak.

Um, and they would also do like
reflexology, but they would also

give you a full body massage
and truly like beat you up.

And there was definitely
a language barrier there.

And they would do this thing
where they would like pull the

hair back and it always felt like
it was pulling all my hair out.

And it would kind of hurt more
than anything else they would do.

And the only time that I
actually said, Hey, could you

do things a little bit softer?

It like ruined the whole
rest of my experience.

It's like I had asked them to
be different than who they were.

Hmm.

And then the whole rest of
the time they played small.

Yeah.

Right.

And I'm not saying like, you know,
when I, I've people come to my

chiropractic office, I'm like, please
tell me what's not feeling good.

Right.

Of course I want clear communication.

But you know, if you think about
communicating with the unconscious

mind, like that's unclear.

Communication.

Yeah.

Right.

So when you tell somebody be
different, be smaller, be quieter,

be smarter, be skinnier, like
whatever it is, men or women.

When you ask them to be something other
than what they actually are, they start

trying to dance to something that's
not them consciously or unconsciously.

And then I think we can lose
the beauty of who they are.

Yeah, I love that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And you know, and, and to be honest,
like moving, I moved a couple years

ago, like my income went down by 80%.

I knew it was the right move.

It was the right woman.

I was coming back to Colorado.

It was a massive blessing.

All signs were Yes.

And yet it was still difficult.

Sure.

Right.

And I would find myself tired,
stressed, all of these things.

And, and my fiance Stephanie's just
like the most vibrant, energized, like

the two of you would love each other.

Right.

So upbeat and happy and joyous.

And, and one of my mantras for a
while was just don't be a dick.

Ah.

Right.

Like, don't squash her happiness.

Don't, don't reign on her parade.

Like, show up, be a good
listener, ask good questions.

You know?

And I think if all of us can really
realize there's this whole other

life happening outside of us.

Yeah.

And just really embrace people for
who they are, and then celebrate

the things that they're into.

You know, there's mornings I wake up at
like four in the morning and I'm like.

I can't sleep.

I'm gonna, I'm gonna go walk in the forest
and sometimes I come home, I've like

climbed into the river at like five 30 in
the morning or, and I'm like, there's this

little bit of a wild animal piece of me.

Yeah.

That I'm so blessed still comes out.

Yeah.

And I know a lot of people
would judge that, make me wrong.

Don't do that.

You know, and like Stephanie loves
all of the craziest things about me.

Yeah.

And so it's been really freeing to be
like, oh, I need more of that in my life.

So that I think is key.

Stacy Nation: And I would imagine
also like someone can love all

these parts of me in my life.

Morgan Oaks: Yeah.

A gift.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Stacy Nation: She doesn't have to
sign up to go put her feet in the

river at five 30 in the morning.

Right.

But she can go, I love that about you.

And maybe she does sign up for that.

Yeah.

And she doesn't have to.

Right.

Like that's, to me, that's such a
beautiful way of saying like, I can be

wild and I can be this huge person and I
can have all these different parts of me.

And I can also have this partner that
may not have all those different parts or

may have different parts that I also see

Morgan Oaks: value in.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I had it described to me at one
point like this, like, you know, the

idea of these like two universes,
like coming together Mm-hmm.

Right.

And realizing like, I feel
like I know so much about her.

But realizing, I know still just
a percentage of her, there's

still stories that come out
that we've never heard before.

There's still behaviors that
I notice that I'm like, huh,

I've never seen that before.

Right?

Like, so I get to stay curious.

I get to support who she is.

I get to be, you know, curious and
interested about the things that she's

into and not like judge her, not shame
her, not try to make her be different.

Yeah.

You know, truly the idea of like, I want
for her what she wants for herself, right?

Love that.

You know, and when she does those
things for me, which she does, it's

just made it so easy to, um, have more
possibility in my life and and truly

get even deeper into who I actually
am, which then raises energy, joy,

love, compassion, you know, all the
beautiful things we actually want in our.

Our relationships with people.

Stacy Nation: Yeah, I love that.

Love, love, love that.

Morgan, you're such a gift on this planet.

I'm, I'm always just so thankful
when you and I get to chat and

so my next question is about you.

I wanna know what are you
feeling passionate about?

You were talking about like serving men.

You're going to Mexico, like
what is happening in your life?

That you feel passionate about, and if
my people are listening and your people

are gonna listen, we're gonna have
a lot of mutual people listen and be

like, what is this conversation about?

If they want more Morgan,
how do they get more Morgan?

Like, what are the things that
you're doing that you're just

feeling so passionate about?

Morgan Oaks: I.

Yeah, so one of the big things that's been
a through line as well is, um, oh my God,

the movie about Queen Bohemian Rhapsody.

Ah, such a good movie.

Yeah.

I remember seeing that.

I was just like in the audience,
like weeping, like it's just so

amazing and, and like he's just.

Killing it at the, the big live aid
concert that they're doing at the end.

And, and a part of me is like,
gosh, I really want to be

speaking to bigger audiences.

I want more impact.

And the message that was really clear
that I received was like, you can have

that so easy through social media.

Could be 10 people at a time,
a hundred people at a time,

a thousand people at a time.

And so at that point, I really just opened
up my business model a little bit more.

I just wanted people to know
that they had a resource, and

you and I have talked about this,
you know, so on my website, Dr.

Morgan oaks.com.

Yep.

It's an easy way to reach out, get
free resources, and I always put

time available, like if anybody
just wants to get on a conversation.

The number of times I've been
like, oh my gosh, you need to

see this person in California.

You need to read this book.

Start with that YouTube video.

Like there's so many resources, so
easily available on the planet, and

sometimes we just need that person
to help us get in contact with them.

So resource wise, that's one of the
big things that's driving everything.

And then the last couple years I
kept having this kind of like these

nudges from the universe that I
should be working directly with men.

The reality is in my chiropractic
practice, mostly women in all the

personal growth work I've done, mostly
women, people coming to me for coaching

work and shamanic work, mostly women.

And I was like, gosh, like I don't
play, I don't care about sports, you

know, watching sports, you know, I'm
not going getting wild at the bar.

Like I'm not doing a lot of
the quote unquote masculine

things I was doing 20 years ago.

I'm like, I don't even know
how to reach this group.

Right.

You know?

And I feel like a lot of
the stuff that's online is.

Um, it's just not how
I'm wanting to show up.

It's not what I would want to be a part of
and it's certainly not what I wanna offer.

And I finally got to a point where I'm
like, I'm gonna offer what I would want.

Love it.

And so, yeah.

So I took my first group of men
down to Mexico last, you know,

February of, of this year and
just had such an amazing time.

So, you know, I've got another trip
set up for February and that's like.

Working with the shaman I met eight
years ago and getting a tour of Za

from the guy that I met 11 years ago
who brings in all the spirituality

of, of that place and, and doing great
high performance coaching work and

shamanic drumming work and overcoming
fear and really accessing courage.

So that trip's one thing that,
that I'm just really excited about.

And then the other piece is how do you.

Stay in consistent growth.

Right.

You know, uh,

Stacy Nation: that's a, that
word's always a trigger for me.

You know, consistency is a really
hard thing for me, Morgan, so Go on.

Go on.

I wanna hear

Morgan Oaks: that.

Yeah.

For, for everybody.

Right.

That's why we have accountability
partners and coaches and mentors and,

and so I am putting together, uh,
men's group coaching program, right?

So it makes it a little
bit more affordable.

You're shoulder to shoulder
with these other guys that.

You know, have something in their
life they're wanting to improve

and, and I really start with the
framework of we're already great.

Right.

Part of it's just recognizing
our own greatness.

Some of it's redefining what
success actually means to us.

Not to, you know, somebody on the
internet or the zeitgeist of America.

Right?

Yeah.

And then helping people tap into
clarity and courage and, um, helping

them find influence, helping them with
like health and testosterone levels.

But also getting a deeper connection to
that heart and soul and, and that way they

can live a passionate life and, you know,
address their career, their relationship,

their health, you know, those things
that are most important to them.

So that's what I'm in
the process of launching.

And the reality is I just wanted to
be surrounded by a bunch of good dudes

that I resonated with so that I can
keep learning all the things that I

need to grow and that they need to grow.

I love

Stacy Nation: that, and I feel like for
you and I growing up in Wyoming, we're

in these Western states, super high
rates of suicide amongst our, our men.

And yeah, I have continued to have
these conversations with men in my life

about vulnerability, courage, strength,
consistency, clarity, all those things.

Some of what you've done for me today
is really talk about the differences

between your twenties and your
forties and the changes that happen.

And men are not always talking about that
in the way that other men need to hear.

And I love that you're willing
to provide a safe space for those

conversations to be happening.

And one of my favorite things about you,
Morgan, this is really a Morgan love fest.

To be honest, one of my favorite things
about you is you don't ever take anyone

where you're not willing to go yourself.

Hmm.

And that is a huge value in my life
as well as in the people that are on

this series of every person that's in
this series that I'm interviewing is

are people that are living this work.

They're not just doing this work.

The work is the work, but
they're living it also.

And so I just wonder what
that is like for you as well.

Morgan Oaks: Yeah.

I, I, I'm not coming up with a story
or an example at this moment, but I

know that something that's always been
important to me, like if I saw somebody do

something, I'm like, oh, that's possible.

Yeah.

Right.

And I believe in the power of story.

I believe in, um, the power of some,
if somebody else has gone through it.

I can get through it as well.

And so that's really
helped me grow and evolve.

And now I even get to a, a point where
if I'm in something, I'm working with

a coach, I'm, you know, I started
doing Juujitsu uh, a year ago.

I'm like this 48-year-old
white belt, which is hilarious.

But you know, like in class
I'll be like, so what's actually

possible from this point?

And then as soon as they tell me or show
me, I'm like, oh yeah, I could do that.

So I'm, I'm just always trying
to consciously expand that,

that realm of possibility.

And I think when these stories get shared,
when these, even if it's a story of

difficulty, it's like, oh, I'm not alone.

If it's a story of difficulty plus
movement, momentum, or even success,

it's like, oh, I could do that as well.

And so that's a, a big part of
the group and it's been a big

part of, you know, the last.

Gosh, since high school for me,
there was something that happened in

the high school football team that
opened up possibility for me and

it, it changed the rest of my life.

Stacy Nation: Love that.

Love that.

Thank you for being with me today, Morgan.

You are a gift and I am so deeply
grateful for our connection and just how

you always show up for me when I reach
out and say, Hey, I need some help and

I need some support, and I am excited.

I get to share you with my people.

I get to share you with the world
in the way that I know you, and

the best way to reach you is your

Morgan Oaks: website.

I would say that's the best way.

Dr.

Morgan oaks.com and it's also Dr.

Morgan Oaks on like LinkedIn,
Instagram, Facebook.

Um, yeah, and I really want
to acknowledge you as well.

Like I, I've loved following
your journey as well.

I think it was probably, I.

Maybe 2017 when we did like our
coaching and got reconnected,

and occasionally we'll have these
little catch up conversations.

I think I got some emails from you in
the last couple weeks, so I get to see

Yeah, just all the beautiful things
you're doing on the planet, so really

grateful to, to call you a friend.

Stacy Nation: I love that.

I appreciate you in this journey and
thank you so much for being with me today.

I'm excited to see how this all goes out.

We'll share it with everyone,
and now my people get to know Dr.

Morgan Oaks.

Thanks for your time today, Morgan.

Awesome.

Morgan Oaks: Thank you, Stacy.